<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 TRANSITIONAL//EN"> <HTML> <HEAD> <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; CHARSET=UTF-8"> <META NAME="GENERATOR" CONTENT="GtkHTML/3.26.0"> </HEAD> <BODY> On Mon, 2009-12-07 at 11:39 +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> <PRE> On Sat, Dec 05, 2009 at 04:55:57PM -0500, Gaetan Nadon wrote: > On Fri, 2009-12-04 at 19:04 +0100, Julien Cristau wrote: > > > On Fri, Dec 4, 2009 at 12:48:35 -0500, Gaetan Nadon wrote: > > > > > I thought it would be easier to review this list before I create the > > > patch. The modules listed here are not shipped in X11R7.5 > > > (<A HREF="http://www.x.org/releases/X11R7.5/src/">http://www.x.org/releases/X11R7.5/src/</A>). I was able to find them in > > > either 7.4 or 7.3. My assumption is that they are obsolete in the sense > > > that they are no longer built or maintained. Is this assumption correct? > > > The list is surprisingly long. > > > > > Not in the katamari doesn't necessarily mean unmaintained, no. > > > > I remember reading about the concept of the katamari release, so that > makes sense. In the release notes there are explicit notes about what > has been "removed". I wanted to clarify what exact modules were removed. > There are various "maintenance states" a module can be in. > > 7.5 - Removed from this Release > Xprint > kdriver servers > Extensions: (I won't list those already excluded from build.sh, the most > recent one being xtrap) > XEVIE > FontCache > XFree86-Misc > > The extensions are the ones I ma most interested in for the immediate. > Then I saw all these apps, most of them last shipped in 7.3, which are > not mentioned in 7.4 release notes. That left me confused. many apps aren't vital to have a working window system (e.g. xlogo). most of these apps also use the core protocol which is set in stone. The only time they can break is when we screw with the build system, library header files, etc. To catch such errors, it's good to have them in the build. However, it'd be interesting to find out how much use some of these apps see and whether it's worth formally discontinuing them. > To avoid confusion, my question is strictly related to whether or not > the modules listed below should be in build.sh. This means they will > continue receiving build related maintenance (upgrades, fix) and any fix > required if a build breakage occurs. This will happen, just by virtue of > being in build.sh. This is the minimum. They may receive additional code > changes, like upgrade on the latest level of ABIs. Sometimes we don't > want that to preserve the last intended commit . for most of the apps, if they ever need updating for the latest ABI we've screwed up quite badly :) > I'll add information from the maintainers list, that should help > reviewers. > > Packages Last shipped Maintainers list > --------------------- ------------- ----------------- > > proto/evieproto 7.4 - 1.0.2 No info > lib/libXevie 7.3 - 1.0.2 No info > > proto/xf86miscproto 7.4 - 0.9.2 No info > lib/libXxf86misc 7.4 - 1.0.1 No info > > proto/fontcacheproto 7.4 - 0.1.2 No info > lib/libXfontcache 7.4 - 1.0.4 No info > > lib/libxkbui 7.3 - 1.0.2 Maintained > > app/xsetpointer 7.3 - 1.0.0 Not listed useless since xserver 1.4 > app/appres 7.4 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/beforelight 7.3 - 1.0.2 Obsolete > app/bitmap 7.4 - 1.0.3 Not listed > app/editres 7.3 - 1.0.2 Not listed > app/fonttosfnt 7.3 - 1.0.2 Not listed > app/fslsfonts 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/fstobdf 7.3 - 1.0.2 Not listed > app/ico 7.3 - 1.0.2 Not listed > app/listres 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/oclock 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/rgb 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/rstart 7.3 - 1.0.2 Obsolete > app/scripts 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/showfont 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/twm 7.3 - 1.0.3 Not listed I think a few months (years?) ago there was a thread on this list about removing twm and the result was that since twm is about the lowest common denominator for window managers, it's good to leave it in. also, weren't there patches floating around recently? > app/viewres 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xbiff 7.3 - 1.0.1 Maintained > app/xcalc 7.3 - 1.0.2 Maintained > app/xclipboard 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xclock 7.3 - 1.0.3 Maintained > app/xconsole 7.3 - 1.0.3 Maintained > app/xdbeddizy 7.3 - 1.0.2 Not listed > app/xditview 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xdm 7.3 - 1.1.6 Maintained > app/xedit 7.3 - 1.0.2 Maintained > app/xeyes 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not lsited vital. absolutely vital. > app/xf86dga 7.4 - 1.0.2 No info > app/xfd 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xfontsel 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xfs 7.3 - 1.0.4 Not listed > app/xfsinfo 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xgc 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xinit 7.3 - 1.0.5 Not listed > app/xkbprint 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xload 7.3 - 1.0.2 Maintained > app/xlogo 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xlsfonts 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xmag 7.3 - 1.0.2 Not listed > app/xman 7.3 - 1.0.3 Maintained > app/xmessage 7.3 - 1.0.2 Maintained > app/xmh 7.3 - 1.0.1 Obsolete > app/xmore 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xsetmode 7.4 - 1.0.0 Not listed > app/xsetpointer 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed still useless, even if listed twice :) > app/xsm 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xstdcmap 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > app/xvidtune 7.3 - 1.0.1 Not listed > > driver/xf86-video-sunbw2 7.4 - 1.1.0 Unmaintained > font/bitstream-speedo 7.4 - 1.0.0 Not listed those are the few I can comment on. </PRE> </BLOCKQUOTE> So far, the only sure thing to remove is xsetpointer. We keep the no-longer-shipped apps in build.sh for their testing virtue. Almost all of them are available on my distro. They are bundled in a Debian  package which probably just gets reshipped every release. Protos and libs seem to have been more promptly removed, e.g. xtrap. They can have dependencies built on them and they may have little casual testing value, being headers and libraries. Thanks. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> <PRE> Cheers, Peter _______________________________________________ xorg-devel mailing list <A HREF="mailto:xorg-devel@lists.x.org">xorg-devel@lists.x.org</A> <A HREF="http://lists.x.org/mailman/listinfo/xorg-devel">http://lists.x.org/mailman/listinfo/xorg-devel</A> </PRE> </BLOCKQUOTE> </BODY> </HTML>